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Industry Relations

This is Industry Relations, a podcast that is at the intersection of real estate and technology from an insider’s perspective. Hosted weekly by Rob Hahn (The Notorious ROB) and Greg Robertson.
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Now displaying: May, 2025
May 28, 2025

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg analyze Zillow’s recently released ZLAS policy language and debate whether it reflects a shift in Zillow’s priorities. They discuss the implications of allowing broker direct feeds, the enforcement challenges around delayed marketing, and whether Zillow’s current stance can still be considered “consumer first.” The conversation also explores how MLSs and major brokerages are interpreting ZLAS and how this policy intersects with Clear Cooperation rules and VOW/IDX frameworks.

Watch us on YouTube!

 

Links

Howard Hanna in open rebellion against Clear Cooperation Policy - https://www.inman.com/2025/05/23/howard-hanna-in-open-rebellion-against-clear-cooperation-policy/

Zillow's ZLAS: Make Zillow Great Again - https://substack.com/home/post/p-164029933

Hoby Hanna don't like the rules - https://www.vendoralley.com/2025/05/27/hoby-hanna-dont-like-the-rules/

Key Takeaways

  • Zillow’s ZLAS Policy Language – The official policy now allows listings to be submitted via MLS or broker syndication feeds, raising questions about enforcement and intent.

  • Broker Compliance and Enforcement – Rob and Greg explore whether Zillow has the capacity or systems in place to enforce ZLAS, and how it compares to MLS-style rule enforcement.

  • Direct Broker Feeds as a Loophole – The inclusion of broker syndication feeds in the policy language could enable firms like Compass to bypass ZLAS restrictions.

  • VOW vs. IDX Access – Discussion on how Zillow’s VOW-powered listing visibility may conflict with its public consumer-first messaging.

  • Local MLS Rule Conflicts – ZLAS policy explicitly overrides local MLS or state-level rules that allow extended delayed marketing, creating potential legal and operational conflicts.

  • Marketplace Power Shift – Zillow’s self-enforced policy is viewed as a signal of its growing authority in the real estate ecosystem, independent of MLS governance.

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

 

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

May 21, 2025

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg explore the idea of the elusive “end-to-end platform” in real estate. Prompted by Lower’s acquisition of Movoto, they revisit decades of efforts by portals and brokerages to deliver a seamless transaction experience—from search to closing. They examine why this model has struggled to take hold in residential real estate, compare it to consumer experiences like Amazon and Tesla, and consider whether the real estate agent has always been the true end-to-end solution.

 

Key Takeaways

 

  • Lower Acquires Movoto – Discussion of the strategic rationale behind a mortgage company acquiring a real estate portal.

  • Why End-to-End Platforms Struggle – Analysis of why Zillow, Redfin, and others have failed to deliver a fully integrated homebuying experience.

  • The Agent as Platform – Debate over whether real estate agents already fulfill the role of a true end-to-end solution for consumers.

  • Lessons from Other Industries – Examples from Amazon, Tesla, and travel that highlight the differences in consumer expectations and loyalty.

  • Professional End-to-End Platforms – Exploration of whether a consolidated platform for agents—covering lead gen through payment—could be built, and what it would require.

  • Tech Stack Attempts – Review of efforts by companies like Lone Wolf, Inside Real Estate, and MoxiWorks to build comprehensive agent-facing platforms.

 


Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

 

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios

May 14, 2025

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg examine CoStar’s recent announcement that Homes.com will boost listings banned on Zillow. They discuss whether this strategy is aimed at consumers or brokers, and whether it signals a broader battle for power in the real estate portal space. They also explore the potential implications of a proposed Illinois bill that would require public listing access by law, and debate what government involvement could mean for MLSs, agents, and listing distribution.

 

Watch us on YouTube!

 

Links:

Homes.com will 'boost' listings that are banned on Zillow: Florance

Don't Bring a Knife to a Gun Fight

 

Key Takeaways

 

  • Homes.com vs. Zillow – Discussion of CoStar’s strategy to position Homes.com as a portal that accepts listings excluded by Zillow and what it means for brokers.

  • Do Consumers Use Multiple Portals? – Rob explores whether buyers actually use more than one or two listing sites, and what that means for listing visibility.

  • Government Involvement in Listing Policy – Analysis of an Illinois bill proposing mandatory public access for listings and the role of Zillow and NAHREP in backing it.

  • Public Utility Debate for MLSs – Exploration of whether MLSs could be redefined as public utilities under new regulations.

  • Housing Affordability and Political Risks – Rob and Greg discuss how affordability pressures and political narratives could shift public perception of agents, landlords, and listing control.

  • Shifting to a Buyer’s Market – Discussion of early signs that certain areas are flipping to buyer-favorable conditions and how that could affect pocket listings and strategy.

 


Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

 

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios 

May 7, 2025

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg discuss the broader cultural trend of returning to physical, human-centered experiences amid rapid advances in technology and AI. They explore topics ranging from Compass’s decision to print physical listing books to the rise of tabletop gaming, and examine whether real estate’s resistance to full automation is part of a wider pushback against digital efficiency.

 

Key Takeaways

 

  • Printed Listing Books – Compass’s return to printed materials prompts a discussion about whether real estate is experiencing a retro shift.

  • AI in Real Estate – Speculation on how AI could replace or supplement agents, and whether efficiency should be the ultimate goal in real estate transactions.

  • Cultural Nostalgia and Physical Experiences – The potential link between societal burnout from digital life and renewed interest in human interaction and analog tools.

  • Efficiency vs. Connection – Ongoing tension in the industry between embracing high-efficiency tech and preserving the emotional, human elements of real estate.

 

Links

Chris Saaca on Tim Ferris talking about AI
 
 
An interview with Meta CEO Mark Zuckerberg About AI and the Evolution of Social media
 
Compass "reimagine" MLS books.
 
Companion (Movie)
 
Toby Robertson's CIBACS business (Senior Project)
 

Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

 

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios 

May 1, 2025

In this episode of Industry Relations, Rob and Greg explore the evolving definition of an “open market” in real estate. They discuss how consumer expectations, technology shifts, and the dominance of platforms like Zillow are reshaping what it means for a listing to be considered publicly available. The conversation also covers the historical role of the MLS, comparisons to other industries, and whether the industry should rethink its terminology to focus on “fair marketplaces” instead of “open marketplaces.”

Key Takeaways

 

  • Definition of Open Market – Rob and Greg discuss the historical and modern interpretations of what constitutes an open market for real estate listings.

  • MLS vs. Portals – Analysis of how MLS participation historically defined an open market and how that has shifted with the rise of Zillow and other portals.

  • Consumer Behavior and Technology – Exploration of how changes in consumer behavior and technology have influenced the industry’s definition of market openness.

  • Fair Market vs. Open Market – Debate over whether “fair marketplace” would be a more accurate and useful term moving forward.

  • Risks of Portal Dominance – Discussion on the risks associated with defining the open market based on a single platform’s dominance.


Connect with Rob and Greg

Rob’s Website https://notoriousrob.substack.com/

Greg’s Website https://www.vendoralley.com/about-2/

Our Sponsors:

Cotality https://www.cotality.com/

Notorious VIP https://notoriousrob.substack.com

The Giant Steps Job Board https://vendoralley.jobboard.io/

 

Production and Editing Services by Sunbound Studios 

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